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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I’ve seen several credible people on YouTube say that adding weight to the rear of your Talon is an effective way to improve your suspension.

Has anyone had that experience?

If so, how much weight should one add?

Thanks
 

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Before I even drove my brand new R-LV, I added the Dirt Road Fabrication bumper extender with a spare tire and 3 gallon Rotopax (always kept full), as well as about 40-50 pounds of tools, water etc. for pre-running the Baja 1000. Can not compare it to stock as I never ran it that way, but the "bucking" people report is nonexistent.

High speed dampening is still non-compliant over washboard or small rock fields at speed and will blur your vision/rattle your teeth. When I return to the states I will be contacting Eibach to address that.
 

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2021 1000X Live Valve
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I do have to add that I have the Live Valve suspension, and perhaps it is compensating in some way. I have not run it a lot with the back end empty, but my recollection is that even then it didn't have any serious bucking issues.

The video from Shock Therapy that got all this fuss started was based on geometry (on paper!), but I would like to see them film one in the Arizona desert whoops to back up their claim.
 

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I do have to add that I have the Live Valve suspension, and perhaps it is compensating in some way. I have not run it a lot with the back end empty, but my recollection is that even then it didn't have any serious bucking issues.

The video from Shock Therapy that got all this fuss started was based on geometry (on paper!), but I would like to see them film one in the Arizona desert whoops to back up their claim.

Not exactly stock but still the same geo...

Sent from my SM-G996U using Tapatalk
 

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There are many many factors at play, Over the years my family has owned maybe 50 different dirt bikes, ATV's and UTV's. We are in the Mojave Desert, so believe me when I say we know how to tune suspension for big, fast, desert whoops!. Most vehicles come from the factory with way to fast damping on the rear shock(s), which will favor bucking (no matter what the geometry may or may not be). If you are experiencing bucking, the first thing to do is experiment with slowing down the rebound damping on the rear shocks. Then pile all your stuff in the rear, and fine adjust to compensate for the load.
 

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First avoid Shock Therapy. I have a post here on that topic.

Second, these do buck, even the Live Valve versions, but it is almost exclusively on jumps or fast whoops that are effectively mini jumps. Weight in the back does help take a bit of the bite out, but both my X-LV and my R have updated suspensions (springs and valving) and it makes a monster difference. I got my X-LV done by GForce Technologies in Tennessee. My R I bought used and has Shock Therapy (previously installed). Both make a difference, the ride height in the Shock Therapy is to their spec but is substantially lower than my X-LV with GForce. I think ideal for a mix of rocks, desert and dunes is in the middle.
My meta point? Get the updated suspension work, before nerf bars, lights, windshields or anything else. It is the single best investment you can make in a Talon. It completely unlocks the beast in these vehicles. They are awesome.
 

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First avoid Shock Therapy. I have a post here on that topic.

Second, these do buck, even the Live Valve versions, but it is almost exclusively on jumps or fast whoops that are effectively mini jumps. Weight in the back does help take a bit of the bite out, but both my X-LV and my R have updated suspensions (springs and valving) and it makes a monster difference. I got my X-LV done by GForce Technologies in Tennessee. My R I bought used and has Shock Therapy (previously installed). Both make a difference, the ride height in the Shock Therapy is to their spec but is substantially lower than my X-LV with GForce. I think ideal for a mix of rocks, desert and dunes is in the middle.
My meta point? Get the updated suspension work, before nerf bars, lights, windshields or anything else. It is the single best investment you can make in a Talon. It completely unlocks the beast in these vehicles. They are awesome.
I agree with everything you said except "avoid Shock Therapy." I bought springs from them, I didn't do the entire shock package, and am extremely happy with everything about them. The service was great, shipping was prompt, and I absolutely love the results. But we all have our own experiences.

I would highly suggest suspension before any other "mod."
 

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If you have weight in the back and experience bucking, try approaching jumps differently. Accelerate into them and continue to apply the throttle when in the air, just like on a dirt bike. As noted, with the rear weight setup described above and stock suspension, my R-LV does not buck.

My test was 1600 miles of the Baja 1000 course, on the southern-most 300 mile section. For those not familiar with this area, there were so many whoops that my Fitbit registered 60,000 steps after just one day's riding :)

The real issue is high speed damping compliance, which should be addressed.
 

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First avoid Shock Therapy. I have a post here on that topic.

Second, these do buck, even the Live Valve versions, but it is almost exclusively on jumps or fast whoops that are effectively mini jumps. Weight in the back does help take a bit of the bite out, but both my X-LV and my R have updated suspensions (springs and valving) and it makes a monster difference. I got my X-LV done by GForce Technologies in Tennessee. My R I bought used and has Shock Therapy (previously installed). Both make a difference, the ride height in the Shock Therapy is to their spec but is substantially lower than my X-LV with GForce. I think ideal for a mix of rocks, desert and dunes is in the middle.
My meta point? Get the updated suspension work, before nerf bars, lights, windshields or anything else. It is the single best investment you can make in a Talon. It completely unlocks the beast in these vehicles. They are awesome.
Not sure why you dislike Shock Theraoy. But I would suggest that the problem is that you were not the one to take it into shock therapy to get it set up for yourself, where you ride, you’re riding style, your weight and passengers weight etc etc. Buying a side-by-side with a shock therapy system preinstalled means that it was not customized for YOU.
 

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2021 Honda Talon 1000R
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I too have not heard anything good about Shock Therapy from other local AZ UTV'ers. The quality of the products/customer service is what's the issue that I hear. Having said that I have shock therapy limit straps on the front of mine. I can certainly say they look and work well. But hey, it's just strapping and some mounts, not super complex like suspension.

With that said, I decided not to go with the Shock Therapy setup, and instead swapped the (poor) OEM springs with a set of Eibach springs in all four corners:

c-601-product-releases-2019-honda-talon-r.html

I have the Stage 2 setup and have, perhaps 1000 miles on the springs. I can certainly say they are a huge step up from the factory springs. They were worth every penny in my humble opinion. I do run with a bit of extra weight, including 6 gallons of extra fuel, and a full-sized spare both sitting up high on the machine, and thus far the suspension has been awesome for my semi-aggressive driving style. However, these are too soft for full-on racing applications. I don't race and just care about a good/compliant ride.

Tire Wheel Plant Vehicle Sky
 

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I have a 4 seat Talon4x as my personal shop vehicle.. after revalving and respringing it, it flat out gets it.. it definitely rode night and better than the R, but there is so much improvement laying on the table.. I have done whooped out wide open desert to technical rough rocky trails here in AZ, and can say it rides amazing.. just needs more HP.. A turbo is in my future ..cant get enough of banging gears😄!! I think it would be just about impossible for me to go back to a rubber band !
 

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I too have not heard anything good about Shock Therapy from other local AZ UTV'ers. The quality of the products/customer service is what's the issue that I hear. Having said that I have shock therapy limit straps on the front of mine. I can certainly say they look and work well. But hey, it's just strapping and some mounts, not super complex like suspension.

With that said, I decided not to go with the Shock Therapy setup, and instead swapped the (poor) OEM springs with a set of Eibach springs in all four corners:

c-601-product-releases-2019-honda-talon-r.html

I have the Stage 2 setup and have, perhaps 1000 miles on the springs. I can certainly say they are a huge step up from the factory springs. They were worth every penny in my humble opinion. I do run with a bit of extra weight, including 6 gallons of extra fuel, and a full-sized spare both sitting up high on the machine, and thus far the suspension has been awesome for my semi-aggressive driving style. However, these are too soft for full-on racing applications. I don't race and just care about a good/compliant ride.

View attachment 3220
What tires/size are you running? Looks great 👍
 
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